Environmental activism is not about fame or money. It is all about dedication, devotion and determination. The desire to make a change should be deep - rooted. Green activism is about uprooting from urban life and staying among the people who are affected and sharing their difficulties.

In the heady days of the '60s and '70s, Green Movements drew minute groups of academics, scientists and also ordinary people who wanted to make a change. One such Movement was Chipko (which in the Garhwal dialect means “to embrace”) which came into being in April 1972.

Like many others of its kind in those days, Chipko was not an NGO. It was a loosely formed hierarchy less Association of groups of people from different villages in the TehriGarhwal Himalayas who came together to prevent green trees from being felled by hugging them. The protracted struggle led to a 15 - year ban on the felling of trees.

One of its leaders was Sundarlal Bahuguna. His fiery rallying of the people in the cause of saving the Himalayas, his devotion and dedication, his vehemence in making sure Chipko never became an NGO with an office and the rest of the paraphernalia all led to similar movements across the country. The Chipko Movement echoed even in Karnataka with the birth of Appiko (meaning “to hug” in Kannada) in Gubbi Gadde, a small village near Sirsi in Uttara Kannada district. The Appiko movement spread across the Western Ghats, including places outside Karnataka.

Sundarlal Bahuguna and his wife Vimala are in the city since Tuesday and will be leaving for the Chipko Centre at Silvara, TehriGarhwal on Friday. Bahuguna, who arrived in Mysore from Kerala, visited Ramakrishna Institute of Moral and Spiritual Education (RIMSE) and Ramakrishna Vidyashala, Mysore. He delivered a lecture at Mahajana Degree College in Jayalakshmipuram.

Our Correspondent caught up with the 95 – year - old Green Gandhian at the house of his host, Poornima Ratnakar of Wildlife Conservation Society, Kalpetta, Kerala, and her father N. Anantharaj in Jayalakshmipuram and spent an hour in conversation with this iconic Gandhian who still stands tall, all six feet of him with the trademark white bandana tied on his head. His wife Vimala, small, bird-like and sprightly, sat with him and kept prompting him constantly much to his benign annoyance!

When the Chipko movement was at its peak, you undertook a Trans - Himalayan Padayatra in 1981 - 83. What was the purpose and what was the objective?
You know, at that time, my objective was to highlight the importance of the Himalayan mountain range for it decides the destiny of the people from Afghanistan, India and even down to Burma. It controls the ecology and the economy of the entire region simply because hundreds of streams that flow down from the Himalayas keep the rivers alive apart from bringing in top soil.

The soil conservation role of the trees on the Himalayan range has been destroyed by the cutting down of trees and the plantation of the wrong kind of trees. This cutting down of trees has contributed to the breaking up of the fragile Himalayan ecology. Then, in a bid to conserve water, huge dams like the Tehri Dam have been built. This was a mistake as now the level of water in the dam is going down year after year since deforestation has led to mountain streams drying up.

Deforestation has also led to the faster melting of glacier ice which contributes to various streams that make up the great rivers of the Himalayas. I have been trying to get a Common Himalayan Policy evolved that not only conserves the fragile mountain ecology but also restricts unwanted and unnecessary development in pilgrimage places like Kedarnath, Badrinath and Gangothri.

In an interview given to a national daily in 2003, you had said that the Chipko agitation, as a people's movement, is at a standstill. You had sought support from environmentalists. What do you have to say?
Chipko was not an organised movement. It was never intended to be one. It was a spontaneous reaction of the women who collect fodder and fallen wood for fuel from the forest. The success of the movement obviously meant that there was no need for Chipko. But there are larger issues here. It is not only about Tehri - Garhwal but the entire Himalayan region that needs to be conserved.

Women are no longer the mainstay of a Green revolution. Committed youth and men are needed. Any movement cannot be a structured organisation with salaries but should be made of people who commit their time and their few resources. Only then can it be a people's movement. That is why I had said that Chipko is at a standstill.

Chandi Prasad Bhatt, one of your colleagues in the Chipko movement, had been calling for sustainable use of forest land. Successive Central governments have hijacked the idea and made it only a cloak for depleting forests of its natural resources. Would you agree with this?
Yes. The Forest Act has been modified several times but in whatever form it is still the old British Forest law which meant that wildlife should be killed as vermin and forests should only have revenue yielding trees.

But, you know, governments will work in the proper manner only when there is pressure. For that, there should be the will of the people. If there is will of the people, then forest laws will be pro - forest and not pro - economic development. But where is the will of the people? People expect the government to do everything for them and they are happy with charity.

Why did not the Chipko movement become popular in the rest of the country?
As I always say, environmental activism is not about fame or money. It is all about dedication, devotion and determination. Where are such youth today? The desire to make a change should be deep-rooted. Green activism is about uprooting from urban life and staying among the people who are affected and sharing their difficulties. This I do not see anymore. People are becoming more used to charity from the government, from organisations. The politicians say, "You do nothing, we will do everything for you," and we are happy to do nothing.

But isn't economic development with all its problems like making people used to receiving charity inevitable?
It is inevitable, I agree. But it is quick - time economic development. Economic development should lead to a permanent contentment of the people of all strata of society. This can only come about if the farm sector is given due importance. The migration of youth to urban areas is increasing leading to the neglect of small holdings and the inevitable ruin of land. In our desire for quick prosperity, we are leaving behind a land of poverty to our children. The economic dream, "Big is beautiful" has overshadowed Schumacher's "Small is Beautiful."

You have been called the Gandhi of the ecological movement. How comfortable are you with this?
No, I am not comfortable at all. I am not Gandhi and can never be one. I have only extended Gandhiji's ideals and put them into practice. If Gandhiji were alive today, he would have roused people in a mass movement. All damage has been done by political parties. They make promises and we believe them. Even God cannot make promises and make them come true. Only people's power can bring about a positive change.

One last question. Why do you wear the white bandana (handkerchief) on your head?
First it was to keep off the winter sun and then it became a habit. I got used to it and wear it everyday. It is like putting on slippers everyday!

Maaji, ab aap baat kijiye.
Vimala Bahuguna speaks in Hindi: I have known hardship of living off the fruits of forests and its plunder led me to actively participate in Chipko activities. We come to Kerala every two or three months to take part in the conservation activities there. I am active in the Chipko movement even today and will continue to do so in future.